Host RevSusanne whispers to RevNoel:
Welcome to Open At  the Top, a Science of Mind chat room provided by onlinechurches.com for religiousscience.org.  Please feel free to join in or just to listen!

RevNoel says:
Hi there

Host RevSusanne says:
Hi!

Host RevSusanne says:
Did you get my e-mail re HSC?

RevNoel says:
Yes.  Did you not get my reply?

Host RevSusanne says:
Which reply?

Host RevSusanne says:
I mean the one about additional materials.

RevNoel says:
I replied to the one you sent yesterday.  Haven't downloaded e-mail since 3 p.m. today.

Host RevSusanne says:
OK.  Well I did some brainstorming with Angelo today about how to fill out the requirements for full coverage of our 100 and 200 level requirements.

RevNoel says:
And . . .

Host RevSusanne says:
We will add Emerson's Essays, The Philosphy of Jesus, Some course material I have by Tom Sannar called Pioneers of New Thought

Host RevSusanne says:
and World Religions by Huston Smith

RevNoel says:
In addition to the 120 hours for the Home Study Course?

Host RevSusanne says:
We require 144 hours

RevNoel says:
O.K.

Host RevSusanne says:
So this takes care of that difference

RevNoel says:
UCRS gives only 90 hours for the HSC, AND it's not nearly as rigorous as your version.

Host RevSusanne says:
Well this is what is required for it to meet degree requirements.

Host RevSusanne says:
Also it is more likely to pass muster with RSI this way. eventually.

RevNoel says:
As is should be.  UCRS has no degree requirements, only 120 hours to qualify for Practitioner training.

Host RevSusanne says:
Is it the same for RSI?

Host RevSusanne says:
Hey I have missed you Noel.  This having practitioner class thing is good, but no substitute!

RevNoel says:
I'm not aware that they give any credit for the HSC.

Nan has joined the conversation.

Host RevSusanne says:
Hey Nan!

RevNoel says:
Hi Nan

Host RevSusanne says:
I will brb

Nan says:
Hi Noel, and Susanne!

RevNoel says:
Howgozit?

Nan says:
Susanne, I've tried to log onto emerson institute but  keep getting the message the connection with server could not be established.

RevNoel says:
Susanne is BRB just now.

Nan says:
Oh, okay, thanks.  Howgozit?  Well, at this time of night my thinking is a bit slow so hope I can keep up.

RevNoel says:
I just got Emerson Instutute at http://www.emersoninstitute.edu.  Is that what you were using?

Host RevSusanne says:
I bet edu was what was missign

Host RevSusanne says:
Now you know why I called it a draft!  Sorry!

Nan says:
She had .org at the end... that was probably why I couldn't connect.  I have to contact them to get the application for the home study course.

Sherry has joined the conversation.

Host RevSusanne says:
Nan I was discussing the course with the President of Emerson today.  Boy is he excited about this!

Nan says:
Hi Sherry!

Host RevSusanne says:
Hey Sherry.

RevNoel says:
Hi Sherry!

Sherry says:
Well, da Bulls are ready to play...I suppose I better keep my mind on Jesus.  Hi Nan, Hi Susanne.

Nan says:
I am, too, but I'm a bit intimidated.  Would you believe it's been 40 years since I've written a paper?

Sherry says:
Hi Noel, didn't see ya there, buddy.

Host RevSusanne says:
You will do just fine!  You ask some of the best questions I have ever gotten.  That is what makes a good paper.

Nan says:
Thank you, I certainly hope so.

RevNoel says:
Sherry, have you heard the song, "Kick me, Jesus, through the Goal Post if Life"?

Host RevSusanne says:
And Emerson does not grade by letters, it is a satisfactory performance that we are looking for.

Sherry says:
Nan, don't you love the way Rev. Susanne can make you feel like you can do anything?

RevNoel says:
of life

Host RevSusanne says:
Its Drop Kick me Jesus

RevNoel says:
That's right!

Nan says:
Yes, she has more confidence in me than I do!

Sherry says:
I hate to admit it, Noel, but I have!!

Linda has joined the conversation.

Host RevSusanne says:
It won the most spiritual bad song contest in my chat at TalkCity

Nan says:
Where have you heard the song?

Host RevSusanne says:
Good evening Linda!

RevNoel says:
Drok Kick Me, Jesus, Through the Goal Post of Life.

Nan says:
Hi LInda!

Sherry says:
Hi Linda.

RevNoel says:
Drop Kick

Linda says:
Good Evening Everyone!

Host RevSusanne says:
So I want to know, what did ya all think of the draft announcement I sent?

Nan says:
Everything was great except for the URL. 

Linda will be right back...getting seconds on veggie lasagna

Sherry says:
Oh Oh, I was afraid of that.  I filed it for later reading, sorry.  But I promise to look at it right after I talk to my hubby tonight.

Nan says:
How long does it take to process the applications?

Host RevSusanne says:
Yikes I should tell Linda too.  The extension on the URL should be org.

RevNoel says:
No, it should be .edu

Nan says:
.org ddidn't work, Susanne.

Host RevSusanne says:
Not long.  But I figured that you would have a chance to do it beforehand, since the class will begin in August unless I get some big sudden something, which I do not expect, form ANTN

Host RevSusanne says:
Should be edu

Host RevSusanne says:
ButDr.  Angelo Pizelo, President, just sent me a "Go For It" memo

Nan says:
What do you mean by a six session unit? Six weeks?

Linda is back

Nan says:
Great.  Go for it we will!

Host RevSusanne says:
It is divided that way only for the purpose of making tuition payment easier Nan

Nan says:
OIC

Nan says:
About how much are the books and materials going to run, do you know?

Host RevSusanne says:
I kept in mind that not everyone gets there cash in giant chunks, but in increments

Linda says:
What about the URL?  org wasn't correct

Host RevSusanne says:
I will be e-mailing the lessons to you until Noel and I have the time to get stuff on a ernestholmes.org

Host RevSusanne says:
Linda it should be edu

RevNoel says:
It may begin on religiousscience.org

Host RevSusanne says:
Sorry for the mistake.

Linda says:
Now, why didn't I think of that?

Nan says:
Linda, it didn't occur to me either.

Host RevSusanne says:
Because I didn't and gave you a bum steer!

RevNoel says:
Bum steer = rump roast?

Nan says:
A bum steer is what I had for supper tonight.  My was it touch!

Nan says:
tough!

Host RevSusanne says:
I have it saved in my favorites folder, so I don't think of it much and I was just trying to get a rough draft out for approval before Angelo went to France

Host RevSusanne says:
There are all kinds of subject-verb agreement problems, etc. in that draft, but the main ideas are there.

Sherry says:
And that is what counts!

Nan says:
For sure!

Host RevSusanne says:
Anyway, I have gotten some wonderful input from other folks about it and enthusiasm is building!

Nan says:
About how many will be in the class?

Host RevSusanne says:
There will be at least 8-10 and if more want to do it, then I will open another class.

Nan says:
Sounds good.

Sherry says:
That would be a great plenty.  The Foundationals class is too full to be productively effective, I think.

Host RevSusanne says:
There will also be ministerial interns to assist with studies and they will learn about being teachers by assisting.

Host RevSusanne says:
How many in your class Sherry?

Host RevSusanne whispers to RevNoel:
Noel could you give the questions tonight?  My printer would not print out the questions you wrote and they are so good!

RevNoel whispers to RevSusanne:
Sure

Host RevSusanne says:
Sherry is one of the assistants!

Sherry says:
10 some times, with some "mystery" guests that won't reveal who they are. Sometimes we have 12.  There are so many we have to go to a round robin listserve method, but

Sherry says:
also understand we are going to utilize a billboard that you are designing, correct Noel?

RevNoel says:
Yes, later this week.  Had hoped to do it by now . . .

Sherry says:
Point being there are other tools to assist with the actual chat room, to accomodate a large class.

RevNoel says:
It's time to address this week's reading.

Host RevSusanne says:
Maybe I should be invisible in a couple of those so I could pick up some ideas...

Host RevSusanne says:
GA NOEL.  Please

RevNoel says:
Question # 1: Is imitation suicide?

RevNoel whispers to RevSusanne:
I could arrange for you to visit Christina's class.

Host RevSusanne whispers to RevNoel:
Thanks.  That would be very helpful.

Sherry says:
Emerson certainly thought so, he felt that every man should watch the "spark of genius that flashes across his own mind, and trust it."

Nan says:
I understood it as so  in so far as it is the killing of one's own self-expression.

Host RevSusanne says:
Good Nan

RevNoel says:
The suffix cide means" to cut off"

RevNoel says:
Suicide means to cut oneself off.

Sherry says:
So we cut off our own creativity by copying others.

Host RevSusanne says:
Absolutely!  Completely!

Linda says:
By imitating, we're not showing forth who *we* really are.

RevNoel says:
We cut off our ACCESS to what this Chapter was all about: Spirit within.

Linda says:
Could someone give an example of "imitation"?

RevNoel says:
We don't cut off Spirit, we cut off our ACCESS to Spirit.

Host RevSusanne says:
I have attended some lectures at the RSI Asilomar Conference this week, watching other ministers speak.  I can see how it could happen that you would think anothers way of expressing is so good, I should try that.

Host RevSusanne says:
But the minute you do that you are doing something and it is NOT Spirit expressing through you.

Sherry says:
It starts with peer pressure when we are young...conform or else.

Linda says:
Thus, the suicide...cutting oneself off...

RevNoel says:
I always used to tell myself, "I could never wing it the way Michael Beckwith does."  Then one day it occurred to me, "Yes and that doesn't keep me from winging it the way Noel McInnis does."  Ever since then I've been far more free in my delivery.

Host RevSusanne says:
It was Michael Beckwith I was thinking of Noel!

RevNoel says:
Why am I not surprised?

Sherry says:
Good for you, Noel.

Host RevSusanne says:
But I also saw that what I do has a perfection about it, that there is room for it and it has value beyond expression to me.

RevNoel says:
There is a story about a rabbi named Zoysa who tried to be like Moses.  When he died and stood before God, God said, "I already had a Moses.  I wanted a Zoysa."

Linda says:
That's good.

Host RevSusanne says:
It is authenticity that we are getting at here. Authentic personality.

RevNoel says:
God already has a Jesus, too, so we aren't to imitate Jesus, either.

Sherry says:
So much for my walk on water routine I was about to master.

RevNoel says:
Which means that a lot of people are committing suicide.

Linda says:
Noel, was it Paul that said "be imitators of me"?  What did he mean?

RevNoel says:
He was urging suicide as far as I'm concerned.

RevNoel says:
Jesus said we should be like little children . . . which does not mean imitate them.

Linda says:
Makes sense that was what he was doing.  I just remembered he said that, but had never thought of it in that light.

RevNoel says:
Jesus was an example of The WAY  to be, not HOW to be.

Linda says:
I had the experience once of being in a church that urged suicide.

Host RevSusanne says:
To be true to yourself requires that you have an ever- deeping relationship with Spirit.  This is the true expression of personality.  This is the route to authenticity.

RevNoel says:
Was the congregation healthy, Linda?

Sherry says:
I found a great detector for all this...

Linda says:
Absolutely not!  That's why I left.

Linda says:
I felt as if I were dying.

RevNoel says:
Some Christian books are now calling this "Sprit abuse."

RevNoel says:
The detector is? . . .

Linda says:
Ah, yes.  I read two of those books.

Sherry says:
when I tell myself I "should" do such and such, I usually find I really should not.  The shoulds come from what others think, and my supposed need to immitate.

RevNoel says:
Good point.

Host RevSusanne says:
To be fully self-expressed is to be authentically who you are, and nobody else.

Linda says:
Very good Sherry.

RevNoel says:
Nobody has EVER done what they should!

Nan says:
The "should's" are what I am having a problem with since all my friends and family a Christians.

Linda says:
Tonight I old myself I *should* go to church.  But I realized I was only going to do that because it was what everyone else felt I should do.

Host RevSusanne says:
I am pleased that you saw that Linda.  That takes courage.

RevNoel says:
Yes, Linda, when we should on ourselves, we old ourselves.

Nan says:
Yes, that is why I didn't go last Sunday.

Nan says:
But my husband was upset and can not understand at all where I am coming from.

Host RevSusanne whispers to RevNoel:
Hey we have started a revolution Noel

Linda says:
And the wonderful thing is my daughter didn't go either.  She didn't want to do what was "expected" of her.

RevNoel whispers to RevSusanne:
It's the tip of the iceberg

Nan says:
Good for her!

Host RevSusanne says:
Yahoo Linda!  You are an inspiration to her!

Linda says:
And we had a lovely time here at home.

Sherry says:
That is hard, Nan, and know you will work it out.

RevNoel says:
Next question: Does uniformity preclude union?

Host RevSusanne says:
Nan, it is OK.  He will be fine.

Host RevSusanne says:
Is this question difficult in some way?

Sherry says:
I went first last time, I am giving Nan and Linda a shot at it.

Linda says:
Unity does not mean uniformity according to Holmes.

RevNoel says:
What does it mean instead?

Linda says:
Our union with others doesn't mean we have to act as they do.  We should get along with them but not to the extent we lose who we are.

Nan says:
That is the way I understood it as well.

Linda says:
I like what he says that we "keep intact that God-given something at the center of our being which is the real Self."

Sherry says:
We are all of the One (Unity) and are indivualized  personalities.

Linda says:
I've found that usually if I want to have unity with others it has often required uniformity.  That is usually where I've had to go the other direction.  Like leaving that church.

RevNoel says:
Uniformity is singular, meaning to have  the same form.  Unity is plural, and at minimum two.

Host RevSusanne says:
So if we are coming from the center of our being, a" Divine Person" there will be a variety of being?

Linda says:
Variety in that all are different?

Host RevSusanne says:
Variety in that their is an infinite  field of possibility.

Sherry says:
And it is all ours to use in our own way.

RevNoel says:
All of creation does the same thing, yet each creation does it differently.

Host RevSusanne says:
Said another way, While we are centered in Spirit, the possiblity of Spirit expressing through us is infinite.

Linda says:
The more we realize this the more accepting we can be of each other.  Right?

RevNoel says:
Right.  There is always something new under the sun, as long as someone new is doing it.

Host RevSusanne says:
The more we actually see God in one another Linda.

RevNoel says:
Uniformity is "uniting" with the realm of effects and forms.  Unity is uniting with the realm of Spirit

Linda says:
Beautifully said, Noel.

Host RevSusanne says:
That is a wonderful distinction to carry around in your pocket for use whenever necessary!

RevNoel says:
Bob Dylan had a wonderful way of saying all this: He not busy being born, is busy dying.

Linda says:
I wrote what you said down Noel for future reference.

RevNoel says:
Question # 3: Does personality limit or fulfill our Divine potentials?

Host RevSusanne says:
Should that be singular "potential" Noel?

RevNoel says:
Depends upon whether the Divine is limited to one potential.

Host RevSusanne says:
I think of it as an all-encompassing potential with infinite expression.

Sherry says:
It lets us fulfill our Divine potential/s.  We can let His little light shine through our personalities.

RevNoel says:
One potentiality, many potentials is the way I see it.

Nan says:
Since Holmes said that personality is the floweriung of Spirit within us, I think we are in the state of fulfilling our Divine potential.

Host RevSusanne says:
Well we have distinguished that idea very well!

RevNoel says:
Just as there is one mind, yet  many mentalities.

Linda says:
If individuality is Life's gift to us, the personality is what we make of that gift.  So I would think personality fulfills our Divine potential(s).

RevNoel says:
Does personality automatically fulfill our Divine potentials?

Host RevSusanne says:
Interesting question Noel

Sherry says:
Not if we imitate.

RevNoel says:
Bingo!

Nan says:
Not if we vegetate, either.

RevNoel says:
Shazam!

Host RevSusanne says:
Good students!

RevNoel says:
And not if we regurgitate what we'v `learned.

Host RevSusanne says:
Right on Noel.Last night Michael Beckwith shared a wonderful story.  I would like to share it with you.

RevNoel says:
We were born for creation, not regurgitation.

RevNoel says:
Share away

Linda says:
Can't act it out if we don't really believe it.

Host RevSusanne says:
He said he got this from Candid Camera

Host RevSusanne says:
The set up a store where the gag was that they did not give change, no matter what you bought.

Host RevSusanne says:
Then they filmed people's reactions to not getting change.

Host RevSusanne says:
As yu can well imagine people asked for their money back, etc.

Host RevSusanne says:
But one guy came in, purchased something, did not get his change back, and he didn't react at all.

Host RevSusanne says:
Candid Camera felt that they had to explain that they were Candid Camera and they wanted to know what his reaction was.

Host RevSusanne says:
He still had no reaction.

Host RevSusanne says:
When they asked them about what was going on with him...

Host RevSusanne says:
He said, pointing to the region we think of as the physical locale of the mind

Host RevSusanne says:
""There is no vacancy here."

Host RevSusanne says:
"My thoughts are my own"

Host RevSusanne says:
Now if we all were able to think in such a way, not be reactive to others or subject to that stuff that is shot out of a cannon at us as we go through life, if we could think of the Good, we could put up a "No Vacancy" sign oursleves.

Host RevSusanne says:
Ta Da!

Sherry says:
Well, it is certainly something to aspire to.

Host RevSusanne says:
I wish I could see that film.  It must have been awesome.

RevNoel says:
Another story.  A Zen master went to a hot dog stand and said, "Make me One with everything."  Instead, the vendor gave him a hot dog.  When the Zen Master asked for his change, the vendor replied, "I thought you knew: Change comes from within."

Host RevSusanne says:
But you see, on Sunday morning this week, Linda and her daughter, and Nan all put up the No Vacancy sign too!

Host RevSusanne says:
Hooray for all of you!  It takes courage and practice to do what we know is authentic and true.

Host RevSusanne says:
You have demonstrated that in your attendance in these sessions and in the thoughts that you have shared.  It is an honor to me and a great privilege to share time wtih you each week.

Nan says:
Courage and a bit of a thick skin at times.

Host RevSusanne says:
And now for Rev. Ruth!

RevNoel says:
It takes courage TO practice

RevNoel says:
Here we come, ready or not!

Host RevSusanne says:
Courage = Heart in my book!

RevNoel says:
Seasoned heart.  Coeur Age

Host RevSusanne says:
The hoard descends!

Sherry says:
I'll join ya all in Ruth's room until my hubby calls.

RevNoel says:
Thank y'all for being here.

Host RevSusanne says:
Berry berry good Noel

Host RevSusanne says:
Terrrific!